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Re: Q: what the hell is going on? // A: ...

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Tomasz Konojacki
August 5, 2020 23:12
Re: Q: what the hell is going on? // A: ...
Message ID:
On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 16:46:31 -0400
Ricardo Signes <> wrote:

>  There is not a cabal of people saying
> "let's all break these five things we agree on, quick, before anybody can stop
> us."  I think sometimes it smells that way, but I have been in the discussions
> about what we can and should change, and why, and there is no unified front.

This is literally what is happenning right now and I'm saying this as
someone who is firmly in the "we need to modernize Perl ASAP" camp.

Bumping the major version doesn't give us a license to arbitrarily break
user's code. We need deprecation cycles. It seems that Sawyer & co. forgot that
they exist.

There's absolutely no indication in Perl 5.34 that, for example, the code
that has a sub named "say" will stop working in the very next release.
No warnings, no nothing. This is completely unacceptable.

>There are a lot of specific changes being discussed.  Everyone on the PSC seems
>to agree on Perl 7.0.0 existing at some point in the next twelve months.
>Beyond that, it's up in the air.

There's no reason why we have to release Perl 7 *now*, other than saving
Sawyer's face and brian's book sales. BTW, AFAIK it's not true that
there's a full consensus among PSC members about this.

In my opinion, the only way forward is to release Perl 5.36 which will
add deprecation warnings for the stuff we want to remove/disable by
default in Perl 7 and then continue making 5.x releases until we are
actually ready to release Perl 7. That will, of course, take a few years.

Releasing Perl 7 in the way that was described in Sawyer's talk will
result in a catastrophe. It will be a PR disaster (it already is), it
will fragment the community and possibly even result in a hard fork of
Perl (BTW, as someone who has contributed 32 commits to Perl in the past
year, I will probably support it, if it happens).

I don't think anyone actually wants that scenario to happen. Let's stop
this madness.

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