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Postings from February 2018
On 1 February 2018 at 10:35, demerphq <demerphq@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 1 February 2018 at 10:17, Zefram <zefram@fysh.org> wrote:
>> demerphq wrote:
>>> We can encounter a stack
>>>refcounting bug /only/ because we are serializing the stack to report
>>>some other exception.
>>
>> We can indeed, but that doesn't make it any more possible to work around
>> the bug. It does give you the opportunity to entirely avoid tickling
>> these stack refcounting bugs, by not attempting to serialise arguments
>> from the stack at all. But if you do look at arguments on the stack,
>> you're subject to the refcounting bug, and can't work around that.
>>
>>>This ticket isn't about fixing the stack refcounting, it is about not
>>>dieing while trying to report some other issue.
>>
>> Yes, and that objective is not achievable. The stack-not-refcounted
>> bug cannot be reliably detected.
>
> I really feel like you are missing the point. By adding the eval we do
> not die in at least /some/ situations. That is all our users care
> about. In most of the cases we are going to die a second later anyway.
>
> If the stack refcounting bug leads to a SEGV, then so be it, there is
> not much an end user can do about it. But we do not need to mess up
> peoples stack traces and hide user thrown exceptions when we /can/
> detect it and handle it gracefully, which as I said already /is
> clearly happening at least some of the time, or I wouldn't be aware of
> this issue at all/.
>
> By that I mean the fact I know about this issue is because our error
> reporting pipeline at Booking collects all errors via $SIG{__DIE__}
> and then sends them over the network to centralized collectors. All of
> the code involved to send the error is Perl. Thus intercepting these
> errors does not appear to be harmful. So I see no reason why Carp
> should not intercept them.
>
> Your argument comes down to "we cant do this perfectly so we shouldn't
> do it at all". To me that is the fallacy of the excluded middle.
>
> Carp throwing trappable exceptions while serializing the stack is of
> no use to anyone other than someone interested in debugging stack
> refcounting issues, and losing valuable user data is an unacceptable
> price to pay. If we can reduce the surface area of data loss then we
> can and should do so.
>
> With respect, unless you can provide a better argument or you decide
> to invoke the Pumpking I will merge smoke-me/rt52610 (assuming it
> passes tests). Leaving this as is is not in the
> best interest of our user community.
Patch pushed as 4764858cb80e76fdba33cc1b3be8fcdef26df754
Note this ticket is a duplicate of Perl #52610
Yves
--
perl -Mre=debug -e "/just|another|perl|hacker/"
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