Even though configure.com was detecting the getgrgid and friends, they were not being configured because HAS_GROUPS was not defined in vmsish.h. Even though the functions are now active, the perl tests do not work because VMS does not have either an id or groups command. The GNV package has an id command, and when GNV is better integrated with Perl this will have to be addressed. On VMS, there is no way for a non-privileged user to directly get a list of the users or the groups for verifying the function. A non-privileged user can lookup a specific username, uid, gid, or group name. -John wb8tyw@qsl.net Personal Opinion OnlyThread Next