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Re: POD translation status?

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April 6, 2007 01:43
Re: POD translation status?
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Moin Joergen,

(I think this thread should/could be moved over to pod-people?)

See below:

On Thursday 05 April 2007 21:44:57 Joergen W. Lang wrote:
> Oh my,
> sorry for being so late in noticing this thread. Originally I intended
> to simply have a go at the german translation. Since I am a translator
> (Lama and friends en -> de) and I like Perl I thought it made for me.
> After talking to Damian at last year's EuroOSCON I got the impression
> that it might be a good idea to have a platform for the translation
> first.
> So I started perldoc2. Currently we have a huge SVN repository under:
> I have collected all the translations I could find and with the help of
> a lot a nice people (especially nekral, phaylon et al) and converted
> them into gettext-po format for easy translation.
> We have come to a point where we started to build a platform around the
> data using phaylon's excellent Catalyst knowledge. Due to a lack of time
> (and funding) I had to reroute my energy slightly. So things went a
> little quiet. I know there are quite a few people out there wanting to
> help out (I also thought of involving the .pm groups in a worldwide
> Translate-athon at some stage).
> But first there should be a solid foundation. A few options for this
> exist:
> * Rosetta (not really an option)
> * Pootle (written in Python)
> * perldoc2 (in the making)
> The biggest problem with the existing systems is that there are not made
> for the translation of 'big' strings (aka paragraphs) but for 'messages'
> and 'menu items'. Feeding all the stuff I have now into Rosetta would
> make the perl documentation the biggest project (data wise) in there...
> not taking into account that Rosetta is not FOSS.
> So maybe I should load all the things I have into my own Pootle server
> so there is at least some kind of repository.
> I also have considered going straight for XLIFF so we are more
> future-savvy but we need a way back to .pod.
> I envision perldoc2 as an umbrella under which several projects can take
> shape:
> * create a Perl-based translation platform
> * work on perldoc (make it truly multilingual)
> * do the translations
> * build a community of translators, editors, ...
> so much work to do...
> I would love to put more time into the project. Any help, ideas,
> offers... more than welcome.
> Joergen

Dont worry about the late response, I initially also intended to write tools 
to author POD more easier, including translation and multilanguage POD 

This has been stalled for several reasons:

* it seems a large translator basis/tols/suite etc. already exist, so I
  don't need to re-paint the wheel, and they are much further than I
  could ever get, too
* my own server is not usable for many people editing stuff (even after the
  upgrade of PHP and Mediawiki, you experience random error 500s), and I
  cannot afford the 100..300 US$ for a "real" server - after all I do not
  earn any money with my Perl works
* the software I have written does basically what I want, minus tables and
  charts (=begin table .. =end table and =begin chart = end chart or so is
  what I want to add soon).

You can see the explanation and details here:

Apart from tables/charts, I also intended to "invent" multi-language PODs. I 
though of a scheme like this:

	=begin lang-en

	=head1 This is in English, which becomes the "default" by being first.

	=end lang-en

	This is in English, since it is the "default".

	=end lang-de

	=head1 We sprechen Deutsch here, you Ümläüt ußers!

	=end lang-de

	We return now to you scheduled default language...

Then the HTML translator would transform this into a multi-language HTML 
document, displaying the "current" language which can be selected by a 
button-click by the user (javascript buttons hiding/unhiding the different 
language sections). Untranslated sections in the current language would be 
marked different (light-redish backgroud f.i.).

This would have the advantage of:

* being POD-1.0 compatible
* having the translated sections near each other, paragraph-by-paragraph
  or document-by-document, as you prefer
* allows for partial translations (lack of time, sections like graphs that
  don't needto be translated etc.)
* make for some really nifty HTML display :-D

Plus, to produce traditional PODs for install, one could easily write a 
pod-strip utility, that just strips out the desired language, so:

	pod-strip --de test.pod >test-de.epod
	pod-strip --en test.pod --output test-en.pod

So you could even enter the multi-language PODs into blead, and have Perl 
then install the desired language (or all of them).

However, lack of general interest (I got abot zero replies from people I 
asked about wether that idea sounds sane) prevented me from actively 
spending time for this :)

All the best,


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